Post by Admin on Sept 12, 2016 11:09:37 GMT -5
The following is an excerpt from another Forum and the original poster will be made anonymous
I love JOhn MacArthur, and think he is the best teacher I know of, yet I disagree with John on this point.
It is true, Regeneration was an Old Testament concept, taught in such passages as Ezekiel 36:24-27 and even in Ezekiel 37, but, this is Prophecy, foretelling what God would do in the future when He redeemed Israel from her sin. A common Mystery in the New Testament, that is, a previously unrevealed truth (unrevealed in understanding to men), is Gentile Inclusion. Israel, nor any man, was aware of Christ's establishment of a spiritual Kingdom through building His Church, and it was in the mind of no-one that Gentiles would be included on an equal basis with those of Israel.
I have been debating whether men were born again before Pentecost for quite some time, and the best argument presented is "The Lord would not have told Nicodemus he must be born again (from above, of the the Spirit) if it were not possible."
The problem with that argument is that it is no different than Christ telling men they must believe on His Death and Resurrection (John 6). The Disciples clearly believed Jesus was the Christ, the Son of the Living God, for this was revealed to them by the Father (Matthew 16:15-17), but...
...they were not believing in the Risen Savior, and we have numerous passages which testify of this truth few pay heed to. Here is an example:
Mark 16:11-14
King James Version (KJV)
11 And they, when they had heard that he was alive, and had been seen of her, believed not.
12 After that he appeared in another form unto two of them, as they walked, and went into the country.
13 And they went and told it unto the residue: neither believed they them.
14 Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.
Can one believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the Living God...and not be saved?
Yes.
But that is not the only truth the Spirit of God, in His Ministry as Comforter, is enlightening men to. He is enlightening them to their condition and the Remedy for that condition. The Gospel of Christ was a Mystery not revealed to men prior to the coming of the Comforter, It is when He arrives that He begins performing that taught by Christ here:
John 16:7-9
King James Version (KJV)
7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.
8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;
We do not question whether men were justified by faith prior to Pentecost, they were. However, if we look at justification, the means of which being exclusive to the persons themselves, we see a distinct difference between one being justified through faith in God and being justified through Christ and His Sacrifice.
For example:
Romans 3:21-26
King James Version (KJV)
21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
Most will reject this, but, the fact is that Old Testament Saints died apart from Atonement. THe only atonement for sins they received was temporal and temporary, and had to be repeated because it could not make them complete in regards to remission of sins (Hebrews 10:1-4). But, the Sacrifice of Christ not only makes us (and the Old Testament Saints) complete, it does so...
...forever (Hebrews 10:10-14).
The Security of the Old Testament Saint was as assured as ours, for they were justified by grace through faith alone. But, we cannot overlook that fact that they were still in need of Redemption, Atonement, and reconciliation with God. When we equate their salvation, which was incomplete in regards to Atonement (and that is a hard concept for some to accept), then we devalue the magnitude of what Christ accomplished in His Work.
God bless.
Being born of water and spirit is an Old Testament idea.
www.gty.org/resources/bible-qna/BQ072413/what-does-it-mean-to-be-born-of-water-and-spirit
www.gty.org/resources/bible-qna/BQ072413/what-does-it-mean-to-be-born-of-water-and-spirit
I love JOhn MacArthur, and think he is the best teacher I know of, yet I disagree with John on this point.
It is true, Regeneration was an Old Testament concept, taught in such passages as Ezekiel 36:24-27 and even in Ezekiel 37, but, this is Prophecy, foretelling what God would do in the future when He redeemed Israel from her sin. A common Mystery in the New Testament, that is, a previously unrevealed truth (unrevealed in understanding to men), is Gentile Inclusion. Israel, nor any man, was aware of Christ's establishment of a spiritual Kingdom through building His Church, and it was in the mind of no-one that Gentiles would be included on an equal basis with those of Israel.
I have been debating whether men were born again before Pentecost for quite some time, and the best argument presented is "The Lord would not have told Nicodemus he must be born again (from above, of the the Spirit) if it were not possible."
The problem with that argument is that it is no different than Christ telling men they must believe on His Death and Resurrection (John 6). The Disciples clearly believed Jesus was the Christ, the Son of the Living God, for this was revealed to them by the Father (Matthew 16:15-17), but...
...they were not believing in the Risen Savior, and we have numerous passages which testify of this truth few pay heed to. Here is an example:
Mark 16:11-14
King James Version (KJV)
11 And they, when they had heard that he was alive, and had been seen of her, believed not.
12 After that he appeared in another form unto two of them, as they walked, and went into the country.
13 And they went and told it unto the residue: neither believed they them.
14 Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.
Can one believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the Living God...and not be saved?
Yes.
But that is not the only truth the Spirit of God, in His Ministry as Comforter, is enlightening men to. He is enlightening them to their condition and the Remedy for that condition. The Gospel of Christ was a Mystery not revealed to men prior to the coming of the Comforter, It is when He arrives that He begins performing that taught by Christ here:
John 16:7-9
King James Version (KJV)
7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.
8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;
We do not question whether men were justified by faith prior to Pentecost, they were. However, if we look at justification, the means of which being exclusive to the persons themselves, we see a distinct difference between one being justified through faith in God and being justified through Christ and His Sacrifice.
For example:
Romans 3:21-26
King James Version (KJV)
21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
Most will reject this, but, the fact is that Old Testament Saints died apart from Atonement. THe only atonement for sins they received was temporal and temporary, and had to be repeated because it could not make them complete in regards to remission of sins (Hebrews 10:1-4). But, the Sacrifice of Christ not only makes us (and the Old Testament Saints) complete, it does so...
...forever (Hebrews 10:10-14).
The Security of the Old Testament Saint was as assured as ours, for they were justified by grace through faith alone. But, we cannot overlook that fact that they were still in need of Redemption, Atonement, and reconciliation with God. When we equate their salvation, which was incomplete in regards to Atonement (and that is a hard concept for some to accept), then we devalue the magnitude of what Christ accomplished in His Work.
God bless.