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P1LGR1M
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Random Rapture Post Jan 6, 2015 7:45:23 GMT -5

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Post by P1LGR1M on Jan 6, 2015 7:45:23 GMT -5

Originally Posted by Anonymous Poster
deut 30:11-14
rom 10:6-11
act 16:31
rom 10:9
( there is no mystery in christ, we should not just reley on others to teach us what and how to believe. we should always go first to the soucre of or salvation, and read his plan for our lifes.)
most importantily we need to test all things. just because someone teaches you one thing, search out and see if it lines up with what God says. rom 3:4 "let God be true and everyman a lier"

Hello again Amy, there is no denying that the Mystery of Christ is a biblical truth which was only revealed at the appointed time:

1 Corinthians 2

King James Version (KJV)

1 And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God.

2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.

3 And I was with you in weakness, and in fear, and in much trembling.

4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:

5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.

6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:

7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:

8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

In view we have the mystery which even the disciples, until the Day of Pentecost, can be seen not to understand.

Had those that crucified the Lord (Satan being behind this) known this previously unrevealed truth, they would not have crucified Him.

The following...

9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.

...is usually thought to be a reference to Heaven (i.e. we just can't imagine how great it will be) but in fact the context seems to have this referring to the work of Chrsit on the Cross, a foreshadowing of Chrsit which we nor any man would have understood outside of the knowledge of the work accomplished but also one more very important factor:

10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

One can have an intellectual knowledge of Christ but only we as believers indwelt by God can actually understand not only the work of Christ but the prophecy of Messiah in the Old Testament.

Again we see the Gospel of Christ spoken of as a mystery:

Romans 16:25

King James Version (KJV)

25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,

Here it said to have been hidden since the world began. Spoken of in Genesis 3:15, but the context was not clear to them.

And again:

Ephesians 3

King James Version (KJV)

1 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,

2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:

3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,

4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

5Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

Little commentary is needed here but to point out that a focus on Gentile inclusion is present though equally important to keep v.9 in view as we digest this great honor that we in this Age have been given.

Again we see the source for understanding is the Comforter. He revealed and reveals it to men (general term to include both male and female).

6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

Before we decide that this mystery only extends to Gentile inclusion, we read on:

7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.

8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;

9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

In order to keep this short a look at Strong's will help a further study of mystery.

That a "mystery" is a previously unrevealed truth can be seen in many of the verses where it is found. This is one of the points which a Pre-Trib believer is going to bring up in relation to this:

1 Corinthians 15:51-53

King James Version (KJV)

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

In and of itself there seems to be no compelling reason to see this as referring to a pre-trib rapture, however, if we go through this chapter we find that Paul is teaching, and quite extensively...on resurrection. In light of that and the fact that resurrection is a foundational principle of the Doctrine of Christ how exactly do we make Paul's statement that we shall not all sleep but we shall all be changed, or glorified?

Only if the previously unrevealed truth speaks of a particular resurrection, which it does...the rapture. It could be viewed as referring to the fact that there will be those that are alive that will be resurrected but that seems a little weak since Daniel 12:2 alludes to this very thing.

Now, consider that if we backtrack through the teaching of 1 Corinthians 15, we see that in view is a denial of Christ's resurrection. That is what brings this extensive teaching concerning those changed from physical to spiritual (v.44). If we try to force a resurrection of every believer before the end of the Millennial Kingdom, we run into problems, and that is what is in view: we shall all be changed. Does he mean all believers of all time? No, only those concerned in this resurrection, which teaching is directed at the Church.

Physical believers will in fact survive the Tribulation to enter into the Tribulation, they will not at this time be changed from corruptible to incorruptible. So unless we make this resurrection take place at the end of the Millennial Kingdom, or, as our a-millennial brothers believe, reject the teaching that there will be a Millennial Kingdom, then we are forced to consider that this resurrection is not the resurrection which takes place at the end of the Tribulation, as there would be no physical believers to fulfill that spoken about those in the Kingdom, such as long life and benefitting from their labor.

Just something to think about.

And I have to say it is nice to have well working functions, lol: the forum I am on right now has horrible functions.

God bless.

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Random Rapture Post Dec 10, 2017 14:49:10 GMT -5

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Post by Admin on Dec 10, 2017 14:49:10 GMT -5

Another passage where we see the Rapture is found here:

2 Corinthians 5
King James Version (KJV)

1 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.

2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven:

3 If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked.

What Paul is speaking about here is the earthly body we currently reside in. He makes the point "We live in physical bodies but we have a body that is made by God that is eternal."

His second point is "We groan, or in other words, earnestly yearn to be "clothed" in that eternal (glorified) body, rather than the physical body which grows old, weakens, and will eventually die. We look forward to being that body."

Now, here is the point you need to give some consideration: to be "clothed with the eternal body" refers to our "wearing" that body, which Paul has just contrasted with our earthly bodies. And what he means by being found "naked" is a reference to our spirits leaving the earthly body prior to our being clothed with that eternal body. In view is Paul making the statement "We desire, not to die (wherein we would be "naked"), but to, while we yet live...receive that eternal, glorified body.

We desire to be made like Christ, to be glorified as He was as God has promised He will do for His saints.

If you don't see this, go back and read it again, I assure that is what he (Paul) is saying.

4 For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life.

Again, "Not that we should die physically (be unclothed), but that our mortal bodies be made immortal."

And I would point out that while we, being born again and reconciled to God (immersed in unchanging eternal union with God), now have eternal life (1 John 5:11-13), we must distinguish in Scripture whether a reference deals specifically with the physical or the eternal. What I mean by that is though we have eternal life through our union with God-for He eternally indwells the believer (John 14:16)-we have not as yet received our eternal, glorified body. We remain in fallen flesh, and the resurrection we have attained to through Christ is the resurrection of man spiritually. The indwelling of the Spirit of God is our guarantee that we will receive the eternal body promised by God:

5 Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit.

In other words, "He Who (Sovereign God) created us for the specific intent that we live eternally with Him has given-as He promised He would do in the Old Testament prophecies-us His Spirit...

...which guarantees He will finish the work He has begun in us.

In other words there is no question as to whether the born again believer will be glorified and dwell eternally with God. The only question that remains is when that is going to take place. And what Paul is saying here is that we desire that it go ahead and take place, but again we do not simply desire to die and be freed from fallen flesh (which is burdensome).

6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:

Man simply cannot dwell with God (in His realm) while we are in this body. Here we again distinguish between the spiritual and eternal, and understand Paul is speaking about a physical separation only, for we are eternally in union with God through Reconciliation effected by the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:)

8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

What he means is that death is not something we are afraid of, for we know that if we do die physically we shall be with the Lord. The separation that exists on a physical level will end, and our physical bodies (which do not allow us to come into God's presence physically) will no longer keep us from God.

When men die their spirits are separated from their physical bodies, the body remaining in the physical realm, their spirits passing into eternity. We see the Lord affirm the disciples' understanding of this here:

Luke 24:36-39
King James Version (KJV)

36 And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.

37 But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit.

38 And he said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts?

39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

It is not a "soul" in view here, but a spirit. When Christ died His Spirit departed the body created for the Incarnation, and when He took His life back up He arose in glorified form. When God created man He did not give man a "soul," but rather a body and spirit, thus making man a soul. It is proper to call a departed spirit in Heaven a soul, for it is the person in view,usually, when reference is made to a soul.
So should we die prior to the Rapture, our spirit shall be unclothed in that the glorified body is received at the Rapture, not at the time of death. We shall be with the Lord, present with Him as Paul states here. Through faith we live in this body and give no thought to death, knowing our destination at death, however, that does not mean we do not "groan" due to being in this body and what life can throw at us. Think of the Martyrs through the history of the Church and what some of them go through, Even among the Old Testament Saints we see persecution and horrendous sufferings. Though most of us, living in a country where we are free to preach the Gospel without fear of more than ridicule, across the world Christians die on a daily basis. As the time of Christ's Return and the Tribulation approaches that freedom will, I think Scripture teaches, become a thing of the past. Even in America we will see a move to satanic practice and leadership which the general population will embrace without knowing they sign their own death warrants...on a physical and eternal basis.

But for us we can, with Paul, yearn for the Rapture and a departure from this world. Knowing only God can determine when one's life ends we walk in faith whilst we remain in this body, but, we graon in expectation of being clothed with that body made by God which is eternal. We do not groan to simply be unclothed, but specifically that Christ would gather His Church from this fallen world.

God bless.

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Post by P1LGR1M on Jan 6, 2015 7:45:23 GMT -5

Post by Admin on Dec 10, 2017 14:49:10 GMT -5

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